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I spent pretty much all weekend and Monday watching Justice League from "Secret Origins" to "Flash & Substance" and boy was that fun. More fun then usual, because my brother who knows nothing about comics wanted to see the first episode for kicks and was quickly addicted. The Cadmus storyline sealed the deal; not only did it make him say "I'm on the edge of my seat, yo!" but it was also then he realized the Flash is totally awesome. It's possible "Fifty-thousand rotten eggs! And a chainsaw!" will be something oft repeated between us now. XD

I got absolutely nothing done this weekend. But it was kinda like watching them for the first time all over again on my end, too, and that was pretty awesome.

Anyway!

[livejournal.com profile] enchanted_raven wanted to see this; just what happened between Kid Flash & Raven over the course of New Teen Titans.



That sums it up pretty well, but there's hugeness of more to be had. Approach with caution.



Please note totally awesome Batman cameo.

This is how it all starts in #1; Wally does in fact appear soonafter, and not only that, he's wicked defensive of his new girlfriend. To the point of having to smack a Dick.





The trouble starts in #4, when the Justice League shows up.





What I'm wondering is just how long Zee knew about the love spell; I love the League, but sometimes they can be a little Need To Know about other people's lives.

Also, I'm wondering why they didn't stick around to check out her story more. It's not like Raven is the first person that has evil/demon inside them, yet is not evil to make their acquaintance. Jason Blood what? Sure, some caution is merited, but just... ignoring the whole thing? Meh.

She does manage to get their attention, but they're not entirely trusting.





Wally threatens to quit about three or four times before he actually does more then just take off for a little while.

They get Raven back, the healing process begins, and she takes some of Wally's advice and totally gets what she's done wrong. And even though I get what he's saying, Wally definitely is sounding like kinda a whiner; I never knew being special could be such a downer that he can't get over it.







Hyperion made Donna fall in love with him and turn against her friends and all; seeing it was definitely a twist of the knife for Raven.

At this point, Wally stops being so much angry at Raven as caught in the grips of unrequited love for her, and occasionally lashing out in anger over it because that seems to be his default reaction to stress.





It cuts him up, but not enough to stop hooking up with other chicks.



You'd think that Wally would have already figured out a normal life just ain't gonna happen.

I think Barry needed to sit that kid down and have a chat about women now and then, because obviously Wally has some funny ideas about them.





It's weird, because Wally can't seem to get the idea that loving someone doesn't obligate reciprocation; yet the whole thing is kinda Raven's fault to begin with. I think they all need therapy.

But is that the end of it? No sir! In #29, Raven is separated from her body, causing her soul-self to go nuts; on Wally. The angst levels rise astronomically.







Wally needs to leave and think things over again, yeah. I have to admit, that's a very creepy thing to have happen to anyone, so I can't really blame him, but still, jeeze.

It's not like she didn't warn him.



Raven also has some major issues from the experience; and as soon as she gets into trouble again, Kid Flash is on it like white on rice. In spite of railing against her, but what else is new?





While trapped by the Fatal Five, Raven is buffeted with nightmarish hallucinations; Wally headlines.





Awwwww.

Then, Wally does actually quit the team for good in #39. Feelings that have been hashed out repeatedly are repeated and I really wonder about these kids.







The next time Wally shows up, it's after Terra's betrayal and death; I'm not actually certain if he ever knew that she betrayed them... I wouldn't want to be the one to tell him. He'd just get confused! and need to think! ::rolls eyes::





Dick: "Thank you for shutting them up, I'm really not in the mood for Wally's issues." XD

At the end there, Wally's actually dying from his powers wreaking havok with his body; he doesn't actually die (duh) and in fact is about to become the Flash. Which is another Vandal Savage-laced angstfest of it's own. The powers-angst overtakes the Raven-angst, and the whole relationship pretty much never comes up again, as far as I know.

His blonde girlfriend there grows up to be Magenta, a crazy super-villain that tries to kill him/kidnaps him repeatedly because he won't love her and stuff. Heh. It makes a lot more sense since I've read this series.

on 2008-04-16 12:59 am (UTC)
Posted by [identity profile] museofspeed.livejournal.com
Y'know, it'd be interesting to see the Wally/Raven thing brought up in present day. Or has that been retconned? I know Raven and Gar have a sort of thing. Or had. Hell if I understand these things.

on 2008-04-16 07:42 am (UTC)
ext_55333: (kid flash)
Posted by [identity profile] victoria-wayne.livejournal.com
Flash continuity I get, but the Teen Titans love triangles/squares/rhombuses... not so much.

on 2008-04-16 12:45 pm (UTC)
Posted by [identity profile] museofspeed.livejournal.com
the Teen Titans love triangles/squares/rhombuses

The original Titans didn't date, they just all had orgies with each other. Constantly.

on 2008-04-16 02:24 pm (UTC)
Posted by [identity profile] simmysim.livejournal.com
It was brought up again, and yeah it's been retconned just a smidge: here (http://community.livejournal.com/scans_daily/1714387.html) at scans_daily.

on 2008-04-16 04:36 pm (UTC)
Posted by [identity profile] museofspeed.livejournal.com
...

Oh, DC, why do you suck so much? Wally/Raven with angst and using is awesome!

on 2008-04-16 08:48 pm (UTC)
ext_55333: (wally suiting)
Posted by [identity profile] victoria-wayne.livejournal.com
That's neat. (And creepy that he would choose that method of suicide.) I've never read that before, but now I really want to get a hold of that issue. :D

Also... Wally-butt.

on 2008-04-17 01:20 am (UTC)
Posted by [identity profile] simmysim.livejournal.com
It actually kind of bothers me that they went that far with it. Wally's teenage years are really really ill defined, to throw in that he was actually suicidal -- not the normal teenage heartbreak -- without like, ever properly covering it, is just. uhm. Did Barry not notice? Iris? Why was he superheroing? Why wasn't he gotten therapy until his early twenties? It's well and good that Raven helped him THEN, but he obviously had huge issues.

Aaaand I don't like the take that he didn't enjoy sidekicking or "just wanted to be normal", I'm so glad Waid retconned that. It's such a cop out and misread of his character, I feel.

AAAH I'LL STOP MY COMPLAINT PARADE NOW SORRY Dx
Edited on 2008-04-17 01:21 am (UTC)

on 2008-04-17 02:26 am (UTC)
ext_55333: (barry & iris)
Posted by [identity profile] victoria-wayne.livejournal.com
Oh yeah, that part? I dunno. It's not the first time he's portrayed in a way that seems like he never had any kind of mentor/father figure in his life, ever. I think this was also the time period when Barry had killed Professor Zoom and had problems of his own; and Iris might not even still be alive.

So it's possible he's very unstable. Unstable enough to off himself? I guess I'm on the fence.

on 2008-04-16 03:43 am (UTC)
Posted by [identity profile] mayoroftardtown.livejournal.com
I forgot all about his love/hate relationship with Raven. Gotta love emo Wally.

Though to be honest, Wally, maybe ultimately not staying in school is why you can't find a job now. (yeah, yeah, harsh)

on 2008-04-16 08:04 am (UTC)
ext_55333: (flash butt)
Posted by [identity profile] victoria-wayne.livejournal.com
He's always gotta be emo about something; oh Wally, never change. XD

I think their financial situation would do a lot better if Linda was the breadwinner and Wally was the househusband. Yeah, he can't be there all the time and emergencies happen, but he's been unemployed most of his life and those kids have fought aliens. I think they can do without a babysitter.

on 2008-04-16 05:14 am (UTC)
Posted by [identity profile] wachey.livejournal.com
Dick: "Thank you for shutting them up, I'm really not in the mood for Wally's issues."

Lol! Yeah, Dick was like the only one who didn't greet Wally. He was too busy trying to save Garth!

on 2008-04-16 08:14 am (UTC)
ext_55333: (bart!)
Posted by [identity profile] victoria-wayne.livejournal.com
And that's why he was the leader; Dick had the best grasp of priorities.

"What dying Garth? I need to talk about my feeeelings!"

on 2008-04-16 02:29 pm (UTC)
Posted by [identity profile] simmysim.livejournal.com
I loved the concept of most of this run, but the execution was so hard to read. I mean, I can read almost anything, but am BAFFLED that anyone ever spent money on this. It was as if a teenager was writing it, rather than an adult writing about teenagers.
Edited on 2008-04-16 02:29 pm (UTC)

on 2008-04-16 08:52 pm (UTC)
ext_55333: (batflash)
Posted by [identity profile] victoria-wayne.livejournal.com
It's never going to be one of my favourites, but it had it's moments of awesome. There's something very "reality TV" about watching superheroes with issues, too... XD

on 2008-04-16 06:24 pm (UTC)
Posted by [identity profile] enchanted-raven.livejournal.com
Thanks very much for the scans. :) I've been wanting to read this for a while now.

I'd forgotten how angsty and emo Wally can actually get. Its probably a very good thing Dick and Wally are best friends. Wally is such a emotional flake that someone needs to take responsibility. XD

on 2008-04-16 09:01 pm (UTC)
ext_55333: (nightwing)
Posted by [identity profile] victoria-wayne.livejournal.com
Wally makes up for it later on; his appearances in Nightwing were all checking up on Dick's mental state. (Or Barbara, after she broke up with him.)

Both have their moments.

on 2008-04-16 09:38 pm (UTC)
Posted by [identity profile] enchanted-raven.livejournal.com
I'm still really pleased about Nightwing 141. That reunion was /well/ overdue.

On a side note. I love the new icons. Fabulous. :)

on 2008-04-16 11:07 pm (UTC)
ext_55333: (flash butt)
Posted by [identity profile] victoria-wayne.livejournal.com
Thanks. :D

I've been making a ton recently: I should post the other ones...

on 2008-04-18 05:24 am (UTC)
Posted by [identity profile] counterfeitcoin.livejournal.com
Oh Wally! I don't read comics because, um, it's really confusing to try and catch up on the story man, but wow they all look so much older in this than how I've seen them before. But I guess I was looking at a spin off comic of the Teen Titans cartoon? They certainly look older in the link [livejournal.com profile] simmysim left. A lot older. Are they teenagers in that? Heh.

So, the age thing has been confusing me. Is it an anime/manga style thing?

on 2008-04-18 05:37 am (UTC)
ext_55333: (kid flash)
Posted by [identity profile] victoria-wayne.livejournal.com
Continuity is an adventure!

It just causes the occasional headache. ::laughs::

In the first Teen Titans series from the 60's they were a lot younger; more on par with the cartoon, yeah. New Teen Titans takes place after that. I think it's the art style that's to blame for making them all look late 20's or older most of the time. XD

I think Wally was 18 or 19 (new into college and all) when the series first started (and the events of that link, which supposedly took place around issue #1) but yeah.
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